Questions from the floor

Vera Araújo answers questions on the theme:
"Livesimply: our global challenge"

Queen Elizabeth II Centre, London, 16.11.07

Is it necessary to be poor to help poor people?
We really need to understand what do we mean by ‘poor’. I remember I was teaching in a class which had students from different parts of the world. I asked one of them from Ecuador what it meant to be poor.  He said it meant not even having enough to eat. So I asked someone from Switzerland - what does it mean in Switzerland to be poor?  He answered it meant either not having your own house or not owning a car. So the meaning is quite varied.

To be poor (in the Gospel sense) means to have and to use only what is necessary or what is sufficient for a dignified human life. It is like a plant which draws up from the earth only what it needs to survive.   So whatever is extra, surplus, we need to circulate.   To help someone who is poor means to enable the other person to have what I have.  But without excess. We don’t need whatever is surplus.

What links do you see between living simply and in fraternity?
It is a continuation of the previous question. It is enough to travel the world to realise there are many countries living beyond their possibilities and there are other countries living beneath their possibilities. Here I am talking about rich countries living beyond their means because all rich countries are full of debts which in essence means they are spending more than they actually have. Someone has to pay for this debt, this excess. It is not just going to fall from the sky. It is the poor countries who have to pay the price. We should reach the point of being able to demand that the rich countries reduce their lifestyle. It is a scandalous proposal.  It would make you lose an election immediately. If I consider the countries living beneath the poverty line, if I consider these people as my brothers and sisters, then this request is not a scandal because within a family you don’t have some who eat and others who don’t. Everyone eats. It might mean eating less but we need to ensure everybody eats.   If we apply this on a universal level then we immediately see there is a link between a simple life and universal fraternity.

What is the greatest enemy to universal solidarity in Brazil?
I’d say there are many enemies but I have to think what is the biggest enemy!  Perhaps the biggest enemy is the fact that the government has not implemented structural reforms which would address the root problems of the unequal distribution of goods in Brazil. Brazil is a very rich country with a lot of natural resources as well as human resources. It has a lot of advanced technology and industry. But it has a distribution of wealth that is totally and utterly unjust. Government after government has failed to make the fundamental reforms necessary in land distribution, in education, health and legal reform. There are other problems but human resources would be enough to resolve these problems.   The fact that structural reforms are not introduced prevent these other problems from being resolved.

Does the current situation with Islam make solidarity with Africa difficult?   
In a globalised world, every challenge, every difficulty affects us all. Certainly this is true in terms of the challenge of a relationship.   A new relationship with Islam isn’t specific to Latin America but is something which deeply affects the situation also in Europe as we have witnessed through events and facts of the last few years.

What I feel is important, and I think we need to reflect on, is that it brings a new opportunity. Islam is emerging and gives rise to a sense of fear. Fear is often something you can’t reason about.  Fear is not a good giver of advice.   With regard to Islam, I’d say the same as I’ve said for other issues - you need to enter a dialogue. A dialogue means getting know each other. Dialogue means an openness toward the other person or religion. There can be no differences which are greater than that which we have in common and which unites us: the fact that we are human beings. We belong to the same humanity. We are not Martians. We don’t come from another solar system. These are women and men like us. It’s only our fear which makes us feel different, even more different than we actually are. I have had the chance to meet with groups and individual Muslim friends in different parts of the world and I’ve built a real sense of communion and deep friendship with them.

We are too armed - mentally armed. We have to disarm ourselves. We need total disarmament and I’m not just talking about nuclear disarmament. We need a new wave, a new current of friendship, of trust, of simple goodwill and then  we would see fruits emerging.   The real fact is that it is not only we who are afraid of Islam, we must remember that Islam is afraid of us. We are all afraid of each other.

What is the role of women in development?
To bring practical concrete solutions.   For centuries women have been balancing their household books. They know better than men what it involves. They know how to govern the economics of their household so that that everyone’s needs are met. This has forced them to find practical solutions when faced with difficulties. This may just be my impression but I have the impression that we talk too much. To get a project underway you need conferences, discussions, you need books on it and so on. Let’s go straight to the practicalities. I’d say that women bring a practical dimension to development and also a touch of gentleness in negotiations and to the political table.

Where does ‘transforming solidarity advocacy’ - to turn this world upside down - fit into the picture of building a universal cohesion between rich and poor, between exploited and those who exploit? Good and evil have always co-existed. We have always have had to take account of the situation in which we live. But the greatness of every human person lies in the possibility of being able to change the situation they find themselves in. Many times when I am with young people, the most important thing I want to get across to them, is how much they can bring about change. Institutions, structures are built by individuals. As there are structures of sin there are also structures for good, structures of solidarity, structures of love and it is always we as human beings who create these structures. So this capacity for change exists within us. It is together we can build and bring about a difference.

The situation in which we find ourselves today demands of us more than ever before  that we start to build human relationships, build communities. It will be these communities which are true, made up of deep relationships which will then in turn be able to express themselves in terms of laws, in terms of new structures. It’s something that will take a long time. It will take decades, maybe even hundreds of years. But if we don’t start, it will take thousands of years. Someone has to start.

Let’s be optimistic and optimism is also realism . It means believing in our capability of being open to others, of being open to the action of God in the course of history. If we don’t have this optimism we will become depressed; we will be incapable of taking our world in hand and making it a better world for ourselves and for our children and all those who come after us. We don’t want to be marked down in history as a lost generation because I fear that our ‘modern’ times will be judged harshly by history. So we have to change the direction and turn the situation around.

Can you share with us what you see as the signs of hope in our world today?
There are many signs of hope in our world today. We have new instruments and tools  in our hands which if we use them well and if we inject them with a new vision we could very quickly achieve great things.

Another sign of hope is the enormous confusion that exists. This great confusion of races, of peoples, of religions, of different ethnic groups, could, with a magic touch, become a united world, no longer fragmented and in constant conflict. From this unity we would find the ability and power to create and achieve extraordinary and wonderful things. So this mass of confusion is crying out to be transformed by unity where each person is able to be themselves but in harmony with those around them.

Living in the midst of this confusion we don’t always have the key. But the key is in the person next to you. It is with the person next to me that I can start to build this new world.  Fifty or sixty years ago the person sitting next to you would be have been British. But instead, on one side I turn around and the person is African and the person on the other side is Indian and the person in front is Australian.  The world is all around me, I don’t even need to move. This is already something fantastic and doesn’t even take too much effort. Think of London. It could be a laboratory where other people could come and see and say:  ‘look how they live with one another’. Can you imagine those from Paris coming to see how you live?

What can I do to influence the growth of and the promotion of fraternity to make a real difference?
Become a brother or a sister. What does that mean? Starting especially with the person in difficulty or in need - I need to bring them to the level where I am. But to do this I first have to put myself on the same level as the other person.  I’ll tell you a little story. I go often to Brazil and when I go I usually take a week or so to re-orientate myself, above all because the inequalities are so harsh and obvious. And so coming from Europe I find it a shock. The last time I was there, I rang a friend whom I hadn’t see for a long time and she invited me out to dinner saying that we had a lot to catch up on. So we went to a restaurant along the sea front. The food was very good and we talked. At the end there was a lot of fish left over. The portions that were served were too much. I asked my friend, ‘what will happen to the food that is left over. Will the waiter take it and throw it away?’.  She told me to wait a minute and went out. Outside there was a group of street children who were dirty and in rags. She called two of them and brought them inside and invited them to wash their hands. She sat them down at the table with us. No one in the restaurant said a word - neither the waiter nor the owner. They couldn’t say anything because they were our guests. They sat with us and we ate with them. We talked with them.  We gave them their dignity. We were together eating. I could see joy in the eyes of these young boys and also a sense of pride. The whole restaurant (and it was quite a good restaurant) looked on and said nothing. 

To become a brother or a sister with everyone is the seed of a new world.